I put this in politics, because I wasn't sure just where to put it. I watched the debate last night like everyone else in the country... and I began to wonder about the Social Security program.
The reason I mention this is because America has no money. We are trillions of dollars in debt. We borrowed i don't know how many million or billions of dollars from China to fund this war.
So if we have no money and they have to borrow money to get by... then what happens to Social Security? Right now we still have it, but it could probably be gone with a stroke of a pen and just stop funding for it. They could take the taxes we pay into social security and put them somewhere else if they so decide.
So my question is.. for those on social security benefits and those getting old enough to soon be eligible to get it... are you worried about your future?
Do you have any plans if all of a sudden your benefits stop because there is no money? Do you have any park benches nearby in case the bottom falls out and we lose our benefits?
Do you have a plan in case there are no more benefits one day?
Could you support yourself without a check coming every month?
Your thoughts?
[question posted by OreoCookie3]responses and comments:
I am 61 and, before all of this happened, I was planning on retiring this coming June. I am trying to not assume that I will have SSN but let's be honest, if you don't have $1,200 or so coming in every month ... it is going to be harder. I was a "back-to-the-land" hippy type person in my youth, so I know that I will survive but they can't do that to everyone in the USA and not have a revolt. If people are starving on the streets and you reach critical mass, you will have an explosion. [4magoo]
Good thoughts here.. there would have to be a plan B because there probably would be riots and everything else. [OreoCookie3]
i think i could, but a lot of my family could not. and i know most people prob depend upon it to get by [easysidemoney]
thanks Easy... I couldn't get by... I might not lose my home since it is owned by family.. so the landlord being family might not kick me out... but still it would be difficult. I do earn online sometimes a couple of hundred a month, but that wouldn't mean a hill of beans. It's scary to think about it... [OreoCookie3]
i don't draw that much to begin with & if it was cut out i'd be in a mell of a hess.they should have never been able to touch s/s. that's money we paid in for our retirement. it's our money & we deserve to draw it as do the young people coming up. my sons say they'll nver see a s/scheck & i'm afraid they are right. [ANTIQUELADY]
that's a very scary thought but wouldn't put anything pass them. [ANTIQUELADY]
My daughter currently gets SSI and SSDI. She also works part time. The SSI she has gotten since she was 4 and the SSDI was added recently because she had the work credit. She's on a program that allows her to save up to go to school, start a business, etc. Even though she's over 18 I remain her representative payee because she is unable to handle her finances. I take care of the bills, make sure she saves the amount she's suppose to save each month and keep things settled for her. I worry about her. Without it she has no safety net and with her disability there's a chance she would be okay and an even greater chance she wouldn't be. [irishidid]
I understand some of what you are feeling here. One can't help but worry about our children that are disabled. [OreoCookie3]
Hello Oreo I can tell this is worrying you the way it is worrying me too. No I have no park bench, but you know Oreo, I feel that my survival skills are good enough to carry me through somehow and my son with Gods holy hand on us. Amen and not to worry dear friend...I hate to sound like a freak, but I feel God will provide. xoooxox [OceanTiara]
So far I don't think anyone would DARE take the SS benefits away from those who already get it or are close to being eligible without a revolt the likes of which nobody has ever seen but I really worry about the younger people. Let's face it, there aren't very many companies that offer good pension plans like there once were and few people are able to put much away for themselves these days, if they're even lucky enough to have a halfway decent job. I know one thing, I'm sure glad they never got around to privatizing SS like they were discussing because with the way the stock market's been lately can you even imagine how many people would have found themselves too old or unable to work and totally penniless? Another thing, as unpopular as it seems to some, I think they really should consider increasing the income limit for the payroll deduction. People who earn over I think it's around $90,000 don't have to pay anything into Social Security once they reach that amount each year. Call it a tax increase but I think it has to be at least put on the table. I'm right now waiting for a Social Security Disability claim to hopefully be approved and right now I have no income myself other than the little bit I earn online. I know for a fact my mom wouldn't survive without hers even though she does get a small annuity pension from my dad which is more than a lot of older people get. We may be facing some very scary times. Annie [anniepa]
I agree Annie.. I think we are coming toward perilous times. I think if they were to tank social security people would revolt.. someone already mentioned that.... but where is the money to come from? People are living longer now..I know I have used more social security money than I have paid in..I'm sure of it. I've been disabled since 1993! So maybe I am using the social security money from people that died before they could use their social security. I know ss is invested money.. or at least I think it is. It does worry me what will happen to the old and infirm if ss does tank. [OreoCookie3]
I live on Social Security, and no, I'm not worried. And if you knew more about how things work, you wouldn't be either. First, being in debt doesn't mean there's no money. Second, eliminating Social Security would take much more than the stroke of a pen. Third, if it did fail, I'd probably go live with one of my kids, which wouldn't be such a bad deal for them, since I'm very very good at living frugally. I know how to cook and bake, and sew, garden, and fix things, and have a lot of other useful survival skills. There are a lot of peple out there who have the skills but haven't bothered to use them because Americans have been living the good life and thinking it will last forever. [unusualsuspect]
Yes, I think that this situation is very similar across the western world, certainly in the UK. In recent years no-one - unless they're on quite a substantial income - has really felt encouraged to put money into a private pension to top-up the wholly inadequate state pension. State supervision of the private pensions industry has been very poor. In addition, at present, many people get top-ups to their state pension, if they have little in the way of other income. The way events are moving at present, has certainly come as a wake-up call! Only this morning, news is out that another major building society (equivalent to your savings and loan institutions) is probably going to be bailed out by her majesty's government (ha, ha). I have read about the implications of our (recent) easy credit society, many a time before. But for a long, long time the government and financiers have been able to paper over the cracks. And so it has seemed the past years that it is business as usual. Now the effects of all this are really starting to bite! And there is certainly some howling going on now!!! I have no big plans... would like to make a career change to healing/ complementary medicine... have re-looked at my training plans, so they are more affordable, without taking on too much debt. Constantly thinking of new ways to save, make better use of money... but also not wanting to make sudden change that I might regret... all quite a balancing act. Some thoughts... when it come to retiring... if and when (!) would probably be a slow wind down. Certainly not doing a full-time job one moment and nothing the next. Any pension entitlement is probably going to be very p*** poor, if anything, with so much bankruptcy looming. The National Health Service (NHS) we have in the UK will have to be cutting back it's spending... so that means mostly cutting back on services to the old, who are economically inactive (things will probably get that bad). So it will probably be a mercy, not to live too long after retirement in western society, in the years to come! It is also quite a scary thought to imagine what will happen as the world population continues to go up... Saying all that, refuse to let myself be worried to death by it all. Remember all the millennium nightmares predicted? So many hypothetical scenarios here. In the end, it's probably best to work mostly in the present. Here we come 2012. December 21st 2012 to be precise!!! [dreamhealer]
Recent discoveries have shed a bit of light on 2012. It seems that's approximately the time that "planet X" a rogue asteroid that is about the size of a planet will come rolling through the solar system. Looking at the trajectory the time of it's last pass through here can be estimated something near 4000 years ago or so. Strangely enough the bible puts the great flood at around the same time. i wonder why a people who carefully studied the path of heavenly bodies and tracked them to the timing of events on earth would give up calculating thier calender after the return of something like that? [CarlKnittel]
I am a very positive person and even though I would be in sad shape financially I do know that the good Lord has watched over me for all these years and he wouldn't fl me right when I was reaching my peak. So I would just do what I had to do to survive and leave everything else in God's hands. [eeyore39]
Very good answer. You get the BR. [OreoCookie3]
There are no plans to end or curtail social security checks, the money has already been allocated for this year and to do something so irresponsible isn't something either of these candidates will do. Please work on your fears - do not focus on them, understand them and let them go. Realize that you have always been okay, and you will be okay right now. Please 10 deep breaths and some meditations everytime you feel fear will help allay and relieve some of the anxiety you are dealing with right now. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO LOSE YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS. This may not be true for some of us in the distant future but it is the Medicare program that is projected to run out of money. Is is funded right now for I believe 50 years, social security is solvent beyond that... [kolleenwilson]
Sorry just got over pacemaker surgery and am struggling. I don't like the fear tactics that are often used to scare or motivate people to chose or make an opinion. There is a lot of disinformation being released right now. I just got an email from another newsletter where they are knowingly spreading false rumors about a candidate, so it angers me. Social Security is safe right now that is my bottom line. [kolleenwilson]
Oh my goodness I hope that dosent happen because I have close friends that are disabled and I can imagine how difficult there lives will be without there disably check to help them stay a float.blink [apples99]
i do not understand the policies in your country and would probably not know about the amount your govt spend in setting aside for this program. but i do not think that this program will cease just because your country is facing a crisis. money would still be provided although i do not know where it would come from. it is not in the book of any govt to leave their retired and disabled citizens in limbo due to the financial squeeze. rest assued they would continue to provide for this group of people. [chiaeugene]
I am in Canada, and I get Old Age Security, because many of us were busy taking care of children so could not work outside the home or took time off from work to raise the kids, etc. The Canadian government did recommend that those who worked put money in an RRSP. a registered retirement savings plan. And we have disability for those who are crippled, much like the Social Security. If one does not have enough money we can also get a Supplement, but we rely on those who are working just like down in the States. I have saved as much money as I can, and I think that is what people will have to do. Another thing is those sub prime lenders giving mortgages to people who did not qualify. I would say to save whatever you can, get a high interest savings account and put as much as you can into it, get into the best insurance plan you can, try not to get sick. It is going to be hard. I know that many will be unable to support ourselves and we will have to rely on our savings. [suspenseful]
I'm going to put money away.. my car will be paid off in 2 months.. I will be putting part of that away each month. I feel bad for the people that won't have money to live on.. like the ones that only get $500 or so a month.. they will be hurting badly. [OreoCookie3]
If God-forbid our Social Security benefits are wiped out, I think America should prepare for a major upheaval and downright riot on its hands. Like many people on benefits and rely on that money every month, there would be no way I could survive without it. True, I might have to actually think in terms of maybe getting a job even with my disability issue, and maybe others would also think in terms like this...but then that would create a further abundance of people looking for jobs that don't exist. If need be...I could always move in with my pet rescuer friend upstate...but I would only do that if the absolute worse was to happen. At least I would need a park bench to make as my home... [pyewacket]
I hear ya Pye. I have heard for years that SS will crumble.. I never understood.. but what I understand now is that we have no money. All we have is credit.. we borrow from China to fund the war.. what will happen if the gov decides to take our benefits and do something else with them? It is scary. I could maybe survive because of my living situation... if worse came to worse family would not kick us out I don't think..and between me working online I could make my payments each month. But some people would be on the street literally. [OreoCookie3]
It definitely is a scary thought, I remember reading in readers digest about 40 years ago that there will be no money left over for us baby boomers when we get to retire, there are just too many of us. [winterose]
it really is very scary, I am disabled now, but I would be retiring in 10 years as well. [winterose]
I watched it too. I am so scared about when it is time for my husband to retire in about 10-13 more years. I am so afraid that there will be no money or benefits for him when he reaches the age to get it. The economy is in horrible shape right now. It scares me to death. [stephcjh]
I wouldn't trust the government to tell us anything regarding the truth in this matter. One person says SS is solvent for at least 50 years.. let's hope so. [OreoCookie3]
I am 48y/0 and am pretty sure that by the time i get to an age where i would be eligable for benifits there will be no money in s.s. As a matter of fact i think it is bankrupt even now. I am one of those odd balls that think that we should be allowed to take care of our own retirement and the gov. should BUTT OUT! After all we could do as good as or better than the goverment with OUR money simply because we have more commen sense that they do. [cjgrooms]
if the goverment didn't steal a ridicoulas amount of money out of every paycheck we might have enough to actualy put away for retirement. as far as losing it due to bad investments -isn't that exactally what the govermenty has done? [cjgrooms]
Hello Doll I believe that AARP and other elderly organizations are very strong in numbers and there's not a politician that would commit political suicide by getting rid of SS. xoxoxoxoxo [raydene]
That sounds like a good thing... but my son in law said there will be no Social Security left by the time he gets ready to retire. He is 40 now. [OreoCookie3]
I think most of us worry, at least from time to time, about the health of the Social Security system. I know some people who are receiving benefits but not nearly enough to meet the demands of today's world. They must chooose whether to have their RX filled or pay the utility bill for new home accents in a recession. They must pay their property taxes and homeowners insurance. Those bills don't go away in favor of a visit to the doctor or shopping for day-old bread and "house brand" foods. I don't give a rat's a** what our candidates say, NOBODY cares about these people who contributed much in their lifetimes and are reaping little in the way of payback. I've been out of work nearly a year ... my job was "discontinued" so there is no going back. Two weeks before I was laid off, I paid off my mortgage, 27 years early. I did that because of the annual layoff routine the company I worked for had, and I feared that my time would come. It did. But over those 23 years with the company I saved and saved and saved. I also contributed into a 401(k) plan that the employer added to, so I'm OK financially. That's not to say I can run out and buy a new car every couple of years as I had done, but I don't feel threatened by today's economy. Memo to self: You can say that today, RJ. How about tomorrow if the market crashes? (C) 2008 RJScott [rjscott]
You are very fortunate that you could scrimp and save all those years. It's great also that you paid your mortgage off just in case something happened. You have great insight and great instincts. [OreoCookie3]
I have no confidence in Social Security. Our capitalistic society has moved past the dependecy on government like our parents were duped into thinking it would take them to the grave comfortably with Vera Bradley luggage. Even if I get something I'll just give it to my kids, they will need it more than me. They need to privatize SS so people can invest how they want to, not by letting the government do it. [gitfiddleplayer]
In the debate, McCain promised not to touch these programs. I think with all the baby boomers coming of age soon to collect (and some already collecting), they'd have a boomer riot going if they pulled that program now. But I doubt very seriously it will be around 20 years from now. [kenzie45230]
I have my doubts too. And I'm a baby boomer. I've been disabled since 93 and collecting. I don't know how many millions will come of age soon but I hope the money holds out. Money has been allocated, I'm sure... but what if the population exceeds the amount allocated> [OreoCookie3]
Well here is how it stacks up with me and my family 1. We live rural and own clear 10 acres 2. We have 13 others where we live at owing $56,000 left. We have a moveable shed that if we lose the 13 we can move the 12/14 two story shed to the other 10 acres. 3. We have rifles and shells and lots of deer and turkey around 4. I can gather mushrooms, berries, seeds, hazelnuts, rose hips and other wild foods and there is a creek with fish and can fish or make Nets or dams to trap if need. If it gets worse I will find a cave to live in and know how to rough it and know herb lore. Wild herbs to eat and put away and dry for storage. 6.I have chickens and we can eat them and the eggs and I could find wild bird, turkey and other eggs to eat. We will have tools and services and things for barter and trade. Money as we know it will be worthless Most of all I have God and his love and power and word and he said he would care for us and not forsake us. He promised and so far he has not let me down. [Celanith]
Your last 2 sentences says it all. It's going to get a lot worse for us I hear as far as the economy goes... but I do have my faith in God. [OreoCookie3]
I think if you are already on social security you probably won't see much change. However, if you are much younger you may well find a future administration reducing benefits available by tweaking the system to save money. I don't think government will abolish social security entirely (too explosive), but wouldn't be surprised if there are reductions in entitlements in future. [evanslf]
The Social Security retirement benefits are for the generation of people that lived through World War 2 and the Vietnam Era war (as an adult, I mean.) Many of those people fought for the US in war and sacrificed during the hard times, knowing (or at least being assured) that they would be taken care of in their yearning years, when they could no longer earn. I am hoping that American politicians don't cheat deserving seniors out of the money that they were promised. In a way, it would be stealing, considering that those people actually paid social security tax out of their paycheck. So, it's like getting a refund and not a hand out. Why should it be cut? There are so many other pork barrel projects that need to be dealt with before we start cheating our seniors. This is what I'm hoping the politicians will consider. Really, I don't think most retired seniors could fully support themselves without monthly benefits. [beautyqueen26]
That was my worry actually.. that they dip into social security for some other project and then the seniors are left with nothing. Hope that never happens. [OreoCookie3]
My mom and dad get disability and if it suddenly stops they lose their house their home their cars and everything else. I wouldn't let them find park benches I would let them live with me. But with the way it could be going more and more people are going to end of on welfare and stamps which is what they have been trying to prevent all these years.. seems we are backsliding into a process that can't be controlled once it begins it would take alot for people to get back on their feet. [mtdewgurl74]
ok, Let's get to brass tacks. Social Security is broke. it's been brooke since the sixties when the "lock box" bit it's final farewell. That was the last time there was any pretense of a seperate fund. Since then it has all been part of the general fund. Many politicians (thank God they were sent into obscurity by the electorate) tried to do the same thing with pension funds to give the Gov't more money to play sith. The taxpayers could always make it up right? if that were true they could live on the budget taken in from taxes. McCain, like a lot of sensible people subscribes to a true lock box(privatization) but few politicians will say that in public because they get shouted down by the sme folks that made middle America fear wall street in the first place. privatizing social security "locks" it in a box for the person's retirement that no oone in gov't can touch. It also takes it away from politicians who use this "retirement" fund to pay for social wlfare programs like a friend of mine who has recieved SSDI His entire life while never making enough money to even qualify to pay taxes. to be "paid up" in SS you need something like 66 months full employment and you are paid based on the average of your best few years of income. I'm paid up. My income as a trucker was large enough that I more than qualify for the maximum. i can't get more than 80% of what I qualify for because the gov't can't afford it and current projections show I'll be lucky to get half what I qualify by the time i retire. The system was designed to be paid for by those paying in in a time when the country's population was growing and the birth rate was higher than the death rate. The population is still growing but it's immigrant grouth and the birth rate is lower than the death rate. The result is more people recieving SSI and less paying into the system. The next generation is to small to support the last. 401k, IRA, Medical Savings accounts and other retirement sytems that reduce or eliminate taxes on the savings help but, our credit push has resulted in a country spending more than they make and the first genteration in history to have a negative savings average. First in history includes the Depresion. Funny how those poor people still had a net average of savings rather than spendings. About one third of my paycheck went to income taxes when I was driving and almost 50% went out overall with FICA(social security) and other things being taken out. When the gov't gets almost half my paycheck how can I be expected to save? The IRS has record of about 14 years in taxes. Lets take anyone who has been paying into FICA for less than 14 years and Put that money back in Private savings. it will cost a bit but those folks are off the SSI rolls. they now have a seperate retirement account they can keep up and it gets better interest that the gov't. The rest of us will work through the system aloowing the social security system to die peacefully without robbing those who have paid into it. Cut taxes overall. Remove the capital gains tax so that all retirement savings can grow tax free. When people can grow thier money tax free they will be more willing to invest in the market and make the economy grow. Before anyone tells me how risky the market is check your history. Take a 10 year average of the markets value any 10 year period you like from the birth of the NYSE to now(including the depression). In every case the value of the market grows and always more than 10% with an overall average between 11 and 12 percent. it's not guarunteed but that's around 200 years of predictable. [CarlKnittel]
Well, this is quite an interesting thought for sure. Here we as working Class Americans pay in everyday to the Social Security system in hopes someday when we retire we can get Social Security to help fund our Retirement. But like you said, will it be there when I am old enough, and how are they continuing to pay people now as it is? And where will the $$ go if they quit paying out to people who need it from the $$ they take in? Somewhere, I think there are a lot of things they could look at as a whole to protect those who deserve these type of Benefits, and be able to guarantee the help for everyone. I have no idea where it is going to come from, especially with our Economic status the way it is now, but I know we need to get something done before people have to continue to work until the day they are dead. [KrauseHome]
People in every country are talking about similar issue. Any form of governmental benefits. In America an average person has much less benefits in SS than people in Europe. They have different and better systems to protect citizens anyway. [polachicago]